OLD VandyMania.com (ARCHIVE)

Vandamnit wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 2:38 pm MFD=Mathew Fisher Davis. I find his tweets interesting.

I do as well. He knows his stuff and with maturity could have a role in the sport going forward. If that was a serious question, he played for Vandy 2014-18 and played in Mexico in 2020. Not sure where he is right now, but he's a big believer in the Stackhouse staff. He had "issues" with Drew and recognized before most of us did that there was a big problem.

Vandamnit wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 2:38 pm MFD=Mathew Fisher Davis. I find his tweets interesting.

Thanks. I knew of him, but since he is gone figured it was someone else.

Foreverhopeful wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 2:42 pm

Vandamnit wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 2:38 pm MFD=Mathew Fisher Davis. I find his tweets interesting.

I do as well. He knows his stuff and with maturity could have a role in the sport going forward. If that was a serious question, he played for Vandy 2014-18 and played in Mexico in 2020. Not sure where he is right now, but he's a big believer in the Stackhouse staff. He had "issues" with Drew and recognized before most of us did that there was a big problem.

At this point one might question how long the staff stays at VU. Stack rebuffed the Pistons rumor on Twitter a while back, but the mass exodus is troubling (perhaps most of all Adam Mazarai). Ty’s departure means the entirety of the roster who had been at VU 3+ years who had an extra year of eligibility decided to move on. What does all this say? Not trying to start another rumor, but it isn’t exactly reassuring.

I found this interesting and insightful:

I think CSL needs a sit down with CJS....

I don't blame Stack for this. It's a combination of the NIL money, individual circumstances and just the changing tide of college sports. I'm really disappointed and sad- especially about Tyrin.

Foreverhopeful wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 6:33 pm I don't blame Stack for this. It's a combination of the NIL money, individual circumstances and just the changing tide of college sports. I'm really disappointed and sad- especially about Tyrin.

It’s truly remarkable. I loved last years team so much and thought it was true brotherhood. The whole team has been dismantled in just a month.

Of course, everyone is entitled to their own decisions. I just wished to see the team try to run it back. They were scary good the last couple months of the season.

I don't know if it is purely stack's fault or a combination of bad luck or whatever. What I do know, is if your strategy is to recruit them young, develop them, and win the most important part is keeping who you recruit. We aren't very good at that apparently the VU degree means nothing anymore in basketball. Not necessarily everything is stack's fault. He's done very well recently. But you have to wonder if recruits don't want to get the blame and not the glory. Stack won all kinds of awards, the team missed the NCAA. And everybody he benched whether 1 game or all season have transferred. Nobody stayed. Nobody.

We couldn't play a pick up game of basketball, never mind field a team at this point.

It's hard to know who or what to blame. Heck, every one of these transfers could represent unique individual circumstances. Malik Dia and Noah Shelby obviously didn't leave for NIL opportunities at Belmont and Rice, respectively. Neither did QMB or Trey Thomas, and I kind of doubt Myles Stute left for bountiful NIL opportunities at South Carolina. Maybe Jordan Wright just wanted to be at home for his extra Covid year of eligibility.

We just don't know.

Regardless, my primary concern is that (a) we currently show little ability to retain players for a full four years (I still view Jordan Wright's departure as an aberration because of the extra Covid year, which will cease to be a factor in a year) and (b) I don't think we can compete for transfers nearly as well as we can for high school talent for a variety of reasons, including NIL and admissions policies. That doesn't mean I don't think players like Robbins, Manjon, and Evan Taylor aren't solid pickups. I just don't think we can field a whole team of them.

he is dead to me

AuricGoldfinger wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 6:50 pm It's hard to know who or what to blame. Heck, everyone of these transfers could represent unique individual circumstances. Malik Dia and Noah Shelby obviously didn't leave for NIL opportunities at Belmont and Rice, respectively. Neither did QMB or Trey Thomas, and I kind of doubt Myles Stute left for bountiful NIL opportunities at South Carolina. Maybe Jordan Wright just wanted to be at home for his extra Covid year of eligibility.

I think we can rest assured that Lawrence won't be signing for a Belmont or a Rice. I do fervently hope that it's not another SEC team. The knife would be thrust even deeper if he were to earn 1st or 2nd all-SEC honors next year while playing for, say, Florida, or UT, or Auburn.

geeznotagain wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 7:16 pm

AuricGoldfinger wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 6:50 pm It's hard to know who or what to blame. Heck, everyone of these transfers could represent unique individual circumstances. Malik Dia and Noah Shelby obviously didn't leave for NIL opportunities at Belmont and Rice, respectively. Neither did QMB or Trey Thomas, and I kind of doubt Myles Stute left for bountiful NIL opportunities at South Carolina. Maybe Jordan Wright just wanted to be at home for his extra Covid year of eligibility.

I think we can rest assured that Lawrence won't be signing for a Belmont or a Rice. I do fervently hope that it's not another SEC team. The knife would be thrust even deeper if he were to earn 1st or 2nd all-SEC honors next year while playing for, say, Florida, or UT, or Auburn.

Yeah, he's the one that bothers me the most, because he has at least two and possibly three years of eligibility left. And let's face it, we can't rule out tampering, and that just sucks.

go to al.com and look at what is happening at Auburn between transfers and de-commits.

Don’t despair… plenty of talent To to be had
what, too soon to make fun of Alabama?

https://sports.yahoo.com/transfer-jayk ... 38158.html

This just sucks all the way around. I truly wish we could gain accurate insights on why they are leaving and Tyrin in particular. The portal dynamic is horrible.

Must be money. Where and how and everything is a mystery but at the end of the day, it’s the biggest motivator. Sucks for us fans.

dore74 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:14 pm Big money for athletes and VU are not a good match. Could be the end of schools like ours competing in big time college sports if that is what the model is (very quickly) evolving to. From what I've read in other posts and elsewhere, it does seem that that players like Tyrin get approached by other team's coaches or surrogates a fair amount

For kids from families with limited means the NILs may be their only way to an assured big pay day. For instance, how much can Tyrin count on making in the pros (NBA or otherwise) so a large NIL could have real importance for him. I absolutely respect the kids doing what they need to do. Fair is fair and they are the major, major reason college sports is such a big business.

For fans at schools like ours, however, the future is becoming bleak. We may be closer to the Magnolia League or something like it than we think.

So, on the one hand, I totally agree with you and think you are right. In fact, I've sort of suggested as much at times.

On the other hand, I look around. Going down the list best National Universities from US News...

#1 Princeton was in the Sweet 16 this year.
#10 (tied) Duke is, well, Duke
#10 (tied) Northwestern was in the tourney this year (though they admittedly have little success in their history)
(we're at #13)
#18 Notre Dame was in teh tourney just last year as has had a lot of success in the past 15 years despite a recent downturn (though, admittedly, 5 years ago may be ancient history now)
#20 (tied) UCLA was in the final 4 just 2 years ago and was ranked as high as #2 this past year.
#25 (tied) Michigan has spent time in the top 10 in 5 of the past 6 seasons.
#25 (tied) Southern Cal has made the last 3 tourneys.
#25 (tied) Virginia has won a national title in the last 5 years.
#29 (tied) UNC is, well, UNC

I've skipped over some schools with history of success that have struggled recently like Stanford, Georgetown, and Cal.

Other schools just slightly further down the list, but still academically competitive include Villanova and Purdue.

So ... why not us?

It's infuriating that there is this glass ceiling we can't break through ... that other schools do.

AuricGoldfinger wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 6:50 pm It's hard to know who or what to blame. Heck, every one of these transfers could represent unique individual circumstances. Malik Dia and Noah Shelby obviously didn't leave for NIL opportunities at Belmont and Rice, respectively. Neither did QMB or Trey Thomas, and I kind of doubt Myles Stute left for bountiful NIL opportunities at South Carolina. Maybe Jordan Wright just wanted to be at home for his extra Covid year of eligibility.

We just don't know.

Regardless, my primary concern is that (a) we currently show little ability to retain players for a full four years (I still view Jordan Wright's departure as an aberration because of the extra Covid year, which will cease to be a factor in a year) and (b) I don't think we can compete for transfers nearly as well as we can for high school talent for a variety of reasons, including NIL and admissions policies. That doesn't mean I don't think players like Robbins, Manjon, and Evan Taylor aren't solid pickups. I just don't think we can field a whole team of them.

Looking at each case individually it is difficult to blame the NIL for this. That tweet you posted is probably the most damning - out of four recruiting classes only one player played all four seasons. And we've already lost 40% of this most recent class after 1 season. The thing that sucks the most is that CJS has legitimately developed multiple players into really good college players - Pippen, Wright, Disu, Lawrence all blossomed under CJS, but only Pippen finished his college career under CJS. It sure makes it difficult to be that excited about recruiting classes. Along with a certain percentage of players not working out, we now have the issue of the player who do work out not finishing their careers with Vanderbilt.

This whole thing just stinks, because it detracts strongly from all the good things that CJS has done from a player development and instilling toughness in the team standpoint. I get that there are crazy amount of player movement every season. But if CJS cannot hold onto his best players then it becomes more and more diffcult to see how he ever makes the tournament. How did we go so quickly from worrying how we were going to fit the three man class we had coming in to having a 5 man class with a transfer and needing three more players? I know I say that the players who transfer won't be the ones that we necessarily want to see go, but this is insane.

We need three more players now, since Tyrin has left?