Vaccination Status?

[frstev17]

Could it be that HIPPA laws will prevent us from ever knowing the whole story?

[VU1970]

It’s not about public vs private school. It’s not about politics.

It’s about respect for the game of baseball.

Showing up unvaccinated at the College World Series (a potential superspreader event) during a pandemic, then complaining that being kicked out and sent packing (pun intended) is tragic and unfair, reveals an appalling level of self-centeredness.

Which coach, Avent or Corbin, do you think would be most likely to tell his team “do nothing to harm the College World Series”?

I’m guessing it's not the one who brought a planeload of unvaccinated players into an event where upwards of 20,000 people would be gathering every day for a week and a half.

I’d say it’s also probably not the coach who defended himself by arguing that his only job was to “teach them baseball.”

[mathguy]

Could it be that HIPPA laws will prevent us from ever knowing the whole story?

Offically? Yes. Unofficially, it'll leak. There has got to be a vaccinated senior on the NC St. team that is pi**** off enough to complain to his parents and close friends, and one of them will leak info to the press that isn't supposed to be. It'll come out.

[historybill]

There very much is a public vs. private school thing going on here.

I'm afraid that the news media coverage of the legislature has been wiped out under Gannett, but just be clear, under a law passed by the Tennessee General Assembly a few months ago and signed by the governor, public universities are prohibited from requiring employees, students or athletes from getting vaccinated.

That's why the University of Tennessee "strongly recommends" that its students to get immunized but Vanderbilt requires its students to get immunized.

https://www.utk.edu/coronavirus/

https://news.vanderbilt.edu/2021/05/17/ ... -fall2021/

I suspect the same is true of our neighboring state to the east.

So just to be clear... the NC State coach is probably not legally allowed to require his students to get vaccinated.

[baseball1234]

It was the smart, responsible choice. Can't believe a coach and educator of young men could have put them at such jeopardy. I imagine he and his university regret that decision. We were all lucky that the tournament was even scheduled this year. Kudos to Corbin.

A healthy 20 year has very little risk from covid. They are not at great jeopardy. The only risk they took was that it could end their season early. I wouldnt call that great jeopardy. They knew the NCAA's rules ahead of time and made the decision to not all get vaccinated. You make a choice and you live with it.

The ironic thing is their season is getting cancelled because they had 4 vaccinated players, who are presumably asymptomatic and not a danger to anyone, also test positive. But having them play is too much of a danger supposedly. I keep hearing our entire team is vaccinated (although I dont know if that is true). Lets assume they are though. One of them could have picked up covid the week before Omaha hooking up with their girlfriend. Maybe one of them picked it up while in Omaha down at the breakfast buffet line. If the vaccinated NC State players are too much of a danger, we may as well test all our players and quarantine the entire team if one of our vaxxed guys comes up positive too. Only fair.

Unless they give it to an older parent, grandparent, or someone with health issues.

Even the vaccinated players who are positive can transmit it.....THERE IS NO RIGHT ANSWER.

[BILTMORE]

The right answer was for NC State to make clear they were only taking vaccinated players to Omaha. If they had, those "vaccine hesitant" players would've gotten it sorted out real fast.
That way.... those with genuine moral concerns could decide what they wanted to do. But those who just ambled along assuming 1) they weren't personally at risk so why bother or 2) Vaccines are more dangerous than the virus or 3) that it's all a hoax so Bill Gates can implant the world with micro chips would've found the correct information and made the right public health choice.

I have no pity for the NC State baseball program or anyone who bitches about inconveniences of their own making because they refuse to get this vaccine.

A couple of thoughts...
1) the vaccine is of little risk to anyone - far less risk than the actual virus even to the young and healthy. Even less risk (though not far less) to those who may actually be allergic to the ingredients of the vaccine. I personally know three "young and fit" people who have suffered long-term respiratory problems, chronic pneumonia, and/or persistent loss of their sense of taste and smell - not to mention the few elder people I know who died or almost died. I do not know of anyone who's suffered any adverse reaction to the vaccine - other than the sore arm and 48 hours of fatigue/aches.
2) The fact that 2-4 vaccinated players may have contracted the disease rather illustrates the need for everyone to get vaccinated - not the opposite.
3) If NC State coaches had treated this as a public health issue and not a "political" one, they'd still be playing for a baseball championship and their players and coach(es) would not have contracted an incurable, deadly, highly contagious disease.

There's really not much ambiguity about what they should've done.

[alathIN]

1) the vaccine is of little risk to anyone - far less risk than the actual virus even to the young and healthy.

You are overlooking the fact that unlike the vaccines, the virus does not contain Bill Gates' brain control nanobots. If you get infected you might die or have long term health effects, but you will still at least have control of your own thoughts.



You know, really, it's becoming nearly impossible to satirize these people because you can't come up with something more preposterous than what they already believe.

[alathIN]

Sadly, I have first responder & health care family members refusing the vacc & read that something like 40% of ALF workers are not vaccinated.

I am wondering what health care specialty they are working in that they don't have to be vaccinated.
Clinicians in my institution have to be vaccinated to work with patients. For very rare exceptions (such as pregnant women who don't want to get vaccinated until after delivery) you may be able to work from home but there are very very few exceptions and you absolutely cannot be anywhere near the hospital or offices or patients if unvaccinated.

There are vanishingly few people who are literate in health science who subscribe to vaccine conspiracy theories. Certainly nobody who has treated covid patients.
I have seen a few examples online who are not actively practicing (Ex- retired from practice 15 years ago and went into politics), or in specialties remote from treating covid patients - and especially those whose business was adversely affected by the pandemic (Ex cosmetic dentistry) - but I have yet to meet any licensed health professional who actively works in a hospital profess covid conspiracy or vaccine conspiracy craziness.

[commadore]

1) the vaccine is of little risk to anyone - far less risk than the actual virus even to the young and healthy.

You are overlooking the fact that unlike the vaccines, the virus does not contain Bill Gates' brain control nanobots. If you get infected you might die or have long term health effects, but you will still at least have control of your own thoughts.



You know, really, it's becoming nearly impossible to satirize these people because you can't come up with something more preposterous than what they already believe.

If Bill Gates nanobots would have made me buy a couple hundred more shares of Microsoft, I would have been grateful!

[mathguy]

So just to be clear... the NC State coach is probably not legally allowed to require his students to get vaccinated.

Yes, but ... the NC St. coach *could* have told players that "I can't make you, but this is the expectation". The NC State coach *could* have framed getting the vaccine as something important for the good and the safety of the team. The NC State coach *could* have given all of his players information regarding the safety of the vaccine and also the information about the NCAA rules for tournament games. The NC State coach, *probably* could have arranged for vaccinations to be brought to a practice for any player who wanted one.

His comments that have been widely reported kind of make it sound like his attitude was "you can get vaccinated if you want to. I'm not going to. But I won't object if you do." I don't know that was his attitude, but that's kind of what it sounds like.

Big difference between the results from the players between those two attitudes.

[vebiltdervan]

...The ironic thing is [NC State] had 4 vaccinated players, who are presumably asymptomatic and not a danger to anyone...

Not ironic. Individuals who have been vaccinated can still catch Covid (that's why the vaccines were rated 90%/94%/etc. effective, remember?).

Yes, they would probably be asymptomatic, but here's your irony: their asymptomatic-ness makes them pose more of a danger to others. They can unknowingly transmit Covid to older folks who are a good deal more likely to die from it.

[fldore]

...The ironic thing is [NC State] had 4 vaccinated players, who are presumably asymptomatic and not a danger to anyone...

Not ironic. Individuals who have been vaccinated can still catch Covid (that's why the vaccines were rated 90%/94%/etc. effective, remember?).

Yes, they would probably be asymptomatic, but here's your irony: their asymptomatic-ness makes them pose more of a danger to others. They can unknowingly transmit Covid to older folks who are a good deal more likely to die from it.

I'm not sure who but what this means is one of us is behind on the "science". Early last summer the WHO said asymptomatic spread was rare. Then for most of last year it became all the concern and supposedly a serious driver of infection. But then earlier this year the CDC quietly came out and said asymptomatic and pre-symptomatic spread was shockingly low. Less than a percent even between people living together in close contact. However has the "science" shifted again now that so many states started opening up and most people are moving on with their lives? If it has then I'm the one who is behind.

[vebiltdervan]

I'm not sure who but what this means is one of us is behind on the "science". Early last summer the WHO said asymptomatic spread was rare. Then for most of last year it became all the concern and supposedly a serious driver of infection. But then earlier this year the CDC quietly came out and said asymptomatic and pre-symptomatic spread was shockingly low. Less than a percent even between people living together in close contact. However has the "science" shifted again now that so many states started opening up and most people are moving on with their lives? If it has then I'm the one who is behind.

The last thing I read on this subject (which I admittedly haven't tried to stay current on) was from "earlier this year", January, but it was still promoting the claim that more than half of Covid cases were spread by asymptomatic individuals: https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-brief ... tic-spread

I would like to look over the "shockingly low" spread reports you're referring to, if you can still find them.

I see now though why you're upset with the science to the point of sentencing it to serve time behind commas. But in science's defense, I point out that: 1) it's performed by mere people (remember the hydroxychloroquine craze?), and 2) the virus itself is changing & especially lately is becoming more contagious. If you prefer unchanging answers, better to go with religion, not science.

[DivergentDore]

A few more details have been mentioned during the MSU-Texas game. The covid situation for NC St was officially termed "a wildfire" by the NCAA which matches discussions on Twitter of NC St having 6 more players declared ineligible after another round of testing last night.

Second thing mentioned was that the VandyBoys did test today and everything came back clean

[commadore]

I'm not sure who but what this means is one of us is behind on the "science". Early last summer the WHO said asymptomatic spread was rare. Then for most of last year it became all the concern and supposedly a serious driver of infection. But then earlier this year the CDC quietly came out and said asymptomatic and pre-symptomatic spread was shockingly low. Less than a percent even between people living together in close contact. However has the "science" shifted again now that so many states started opening up and most people are moving on with their lives? If it has then I'm the one who is behind.

The last thing I read on this subject (which I admittedly haven't tried to stay current on) was from "earlier this year", January, but it was still promoting the claim that more than half of Covid cases were spread by asymptomatic individuals: https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-brief ... tic-spread

I would like to look over the "shockingly low" spread reports you're referring to, if you can still find them.

I see now though why you're upset with the science to the point of sentencing it to serve time behind commas. But in science's defense, I point out that: 1) it's performed by mere people (remember the hydroxychloroquine craze?), and 2) the virus itself is changing & especially lately is becoming more contagious. If you prefer unchanging answers, better to go with religion, not science.

Which recently was proved by Scientific evidence.

[alathIN]

So just to be clear... the NC State coach is probably not legally allowed to require his students to get vaccinated.

Yes, but ... the NC St. coach *could* have told players that "I can't make you, but this is the expectation". The NC State coach *could* have framed getting the vaccine as something important for the good and the safety of the team. The NC State coach *could* have given all of his players information regarding the safety of the vaccine and also the information about the NCAA rules for tournament games. The NC State coach, *probably* could have arranged for vaccinations to be brought to a practice for any player who wanted one.

His comments that have been widely reported kind of make it sound like his attitude was "you can get vaccinated if you want to. I'm not going to. But I won't object if you do." I don't know that was his attitude, but that's kind of what it sounds like.

Big difference between the results from the players between those two attitudes.

Or, minimally, he could have communicated about vaccination in a way that didn't make it glaringly obvious that he is a vaccine conspiracy theory nut. His press conference comments make it quite clear.

[Starkiller]

I'm not sure who but what this means is one of us is behind on the "science". Early last summer the WHO said asymptomatic spread was rare. Then for most of last year it became all the concern and supposedly a serious driver of infection. But then earlier this year the CDC quietly came out and said asymptomatic and pre-symptomatic spread was shockingly low. Less than a percent even between people living together in close contact. However has the "science" shifted again now that so many states started opening up and most people are moving on with their lives? If it has then I'm the one who is behind.

The last thing I read on this subject (which I admittedly haven't tried to stay current on) was from "earlier this year", January, but it was still promoting the claim that more than half of Covid cases were spread by asymptomatic individuals: https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-brief ... tic-spread

I would like to look over the "shockingly low" spread reports you're referring to, if you can still find them.

I see now though why you're upset with the science to the point of sentencing it to serve time behind commas. But in science's defense, I point out that: 1) it's performed by mere people (remember the hydroxychloroquine craze?), and 2) the virus itself is changing & especially lately is becoming more contagious. If you prefer unchanging answers, better to go with religion, not science.

Which recently was proved by Scientific evidence.

Specifically what scientific evidence?

[commadore]

The last thing I read on this subject (which I admittedly haven't tried to stay current on) was from "earlier this year", January, but it was still promoting the claim that more than half of Covid cases were spread by asymptomatic individuals: https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-brief ... tic-spread

I would like to look over the "shockingly low" spread reports you're referring to, if you can still find them.

I see now though why you're upset with the science to the point of sentencing it to serve time behind commas. But in science's defense, I point out that: 1) it's performed by mere people (remember the hydroxychloroquine craze?), and 2) the virus itself is changing & especially lately is becoming more contagious. If you prefer unchanging answers, better to go with religion, not science.

Which recently was proved by Scientific evidence.

Specifically what scientific evidence?

I have not seen it, but it was reported by both Fox and CNN for about a week a month ago. A study done in the northeast if I recall correctly.

[vandy05]

I'm not sure who but what this means is one of us is behind on the "science". Early last summer the WHO said asymptomatic spread was rare. Then for most of last year it became all the concern and supposedly a serious driver of infection. But then earlier this year the CDC quietly came out and said asymptomatic and pre-symptomatic spread was shockingly low. Less than a percent even between people living together in close contact. However has the "science" shifted again now that so many states started opening up and most people are moving on with their lives? If it has then I'm the one who is behind.

The last thing I read on this subject (which I admittedly haven't tried to stay current on) was from "earlier this year", January, but it was still promoting the claim that more than half of Covid cases were spread by asymptomatic individuals: https://www.advisory.com/en/daily-brief ... tic-spread

I would like to look over the "shockingly low" spread reports you're referring to, if you can still find them.

I see now though why you're upset with the science to the point of sentencing it to serve time behind commas. But in science's defense, I point out that: 1) it's performed by mere people (remember the hydroxychloroquine craze?), and 2) the virus itself is changing & especially lately is becoming more contagious. If you prefer unchanging answers, better to go with religion, not science.

I will say that I have stayed up on it, particularly this asymptomatic piece. Early on no one realized that asymptomatic people could spread the virus. That's just not how these types of things work. What then happened is we realized that asymptomatic people could indeed spread COVID. It became a big talking point and it was discussed as a major driver of infection because it WAS driving infection. Once people realized this thing was a real problem (a few months in), they started adjusting their behavior when sick. They stayed home. But what was happening was that asymptomatic people were not staying home for obvious reasons. They were driving the infection as sick people stayed home. As for the CDC coming out and saying asymptomatic spread was shockingly low, I don't recall that terminology. But what I do know is that we learned that its harder for an asymptomatic person to spread the virus because their viral load is lower. We learned that late in 2020, only a year after this virus was first discovered so I think the science was moving and shaking pretty fast on this one.

[vandy05]

North Carolina State is a public school in the South in 2021. I don't follow the NC legislature, but here in Tennessee the General Assembly passed bill after bill this year making it very very clear that no public institution can require its employees/students to get vaccinated.

Well...

ut:
all students are required to submit proof of:
Measles, Mumps, and Rubella (MMR) Vaccine – Proof of immunization with two doses at least 28 days apart or (+) antibody titers for any student born after 1 Jan 1957 is required.
Varicella (Chickenpox) Vaccine – Proof of immunization with two doses at least 28 days apart or a (+) antibody titer is required
Tuberculosis (TB) Screening Questionnaire and, if subsequently required, a Tuberculosis (TB) Risk Assessment must be submitted.
Students living on campus are ALSO required to submit proof of:

Meningitis Vaccines – All new incoming students who are under 22 years of age and will be residing in on-campus housing, must have documentation of the Meningococcal Serogroup A, C, W, and Y Vaccine given on or after their 16th birthday or they will not be permitted to move into on-campus housing.

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mtsu:
Tennessee requires new full-time enrollees in higher education institutions with enrollments larger than 200 students to be up to date on immunizations. Full-time is defined as undergraduates enrolling in at least 12 semester hours, or equivalent, and graduate students enrolling in at least 9 semester hours, or equivalent. Note: A hold is automatically set to prevent a student's registration until the process is completed. Once completed, the hold is automatically removed and the student is clear to register.

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U of Memphis:
The state of Tennessee requires state public institutions of higher education to verify that students have received mandated immunizations and meet certain health requirements.

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APSU:
The State of Tennessee requires that new full-time, first-time, readmitting, and graduate students entering institutions of higher learning provide proof of two immunizations of the Measles, Mumps, and Rubella (MMR) vaccines or laboratory evidence of immunity to all three of the diseases. A student will not be allowed to register for classes until these requirements are met.

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Tennessee Tech:
Students must provide proof of two (2) MMR (measles, mumps, and rubella) vaccinations. Documentation of blood test (titer- serology) showing immunity to measles, mumps, and rubella. ... If any one of the three is negative, proof of 2 doses of vaccine must be provided to Health Services.

Regardless of the legislative actions, the fact that we require MMR vaccinations proves how sad it is what we've done around COVID and vaccination. We could've had much better outcomes around all of this, NC State's baseball season included.